2023 Payroll Thread

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CardsofSTL
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by CardsofSTL »

I think Liberatore might still turn into something. Maybe not front of the rotation caliber but a solid starter.

Woodford Pallante & Thompson are all bullpen/spot starter types in my opinion, with Thompson being a potential fireman type.

Too soon to tell on the other kids but you know there will be some surprises and some letdowns.

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Big Amoco Sign
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

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I don’t like anything about this. What a gross process and shame on the team. Yes I know "other teams do this" but that doesn't mean the Cardinals can't be better. It's pennies to them. And he's very good and underpaid anyways.

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haltz
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

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Maybe not pissing off your arbitration eligible talent is the new market inefficiency.

I had assumed, if I'd ever even thought about it, that details of these negotiations weren't shared with the players, or part of the job of good representation is to soft pedal some of this stuff to the client. Is the player in the room?

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ghostrunner
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by ghostrunner »

I'd have countered with this:

cardsfantx
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by cardsfantx »

Ahead of their victory over Ryan Helsley in an arbitration hearing, the Cardinals reportedly discussed a multi-year deal with the right-hander, according to The Athletic’s Katie Woo. Woo notes that the sides were far apart, with the biggest issue being Helsley’s durability. As Woo notes, the Cardinals were concerned with Helsley’s rarely pitching on back-to-back days last year, while Helsley’s camp pointed out that he frequently went multiple innings during appearances as an explanation for that.

Helsley pitched on back-to-back days eight times in 2022, with eighteen of his 54 appearances lasting longer than 1.0 IP, though just nine of his appearances involved pitch counts greater than 25. Whatever one makes of his durability, however, Helsley certainly turned in a dominant 2022 season as he pitched to a sterling 1.25 ERA good for a 306 ERA+, meaning he was more than three times more effective than the league average pitcher in 2022. That performance was backed by a strong 2.34 FIP thanks to Helsley’s fantastic 39.3% strikeout rate and solid 8.4% walk rate. His K-BB% of 31 ranked fourth best in the majors last year among those with at least 60 innings of work.

For his part, Helsley told reporters that there were “no hard feelings” between himself and the organization, though he noted that the arbitration process was a tough one and that he and other players “wish it was a little different.”

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heyzeus
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by heyzeus »

heyzeus wrote:
January 17 23, 10:28 am
It's wild because obviously we'd be better if we signed DeGrom and Verlander, but no Cardinals fan expects that. We dont' even expect one of them. Sadly, this is a very good (and possibly great) team that so easily could have been made an unequivocally great team and cost no talent from the present or future club at all. Rodon will make something like $25mil this year. Hell, Quintana would've cost about 13. Looks like we won't be signing Chafin or Moore to help the bullpen, which could use another lockdown arm (particularly a lefty).

So come june/july we'll have to trade an Alec Burleson level prospect, which absolutely is an asset with value, for pitching. Again. Will that prospect turn out to be a productive major leaguer, like Arozarena or Adolis Garcia? Maybe. Will the pitchers we acquire be Montgomery/Quintana (great, but at a cost!) or Happ/Lester/Leblanc (rotten cantaloupes)? Guess we'll find out! again!
I was bangin' that Rodon drum, now he's out with one of those very concerning forearm strains. We still should have signed a starter.

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haltz
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

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heyzeus wrote:
March 9 23, 1:26 pm
I was bangin' that Rodon drum, now he's out with one of those very concerning forearm strains. We still should have signed a starter.
I feel the same way, it just doesn't seem like something the risk averse ROI focused Cardinals will do - it's the riskiest contract you can sign and now Rodon and Quintana start the season on the IL. Then again they've spent over a hundred million on LH relievers and Steven Matz (who I still like) in recent memory with absolutely nothing to show for it.

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CardsofSTL
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by CardsofSTL »

We'll probably trade for Pirates ace Johan Oviedo in July.

dmarx114
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by dmarx114 »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:
February 17 23, 12:34 pm
I don’t like anything about this. What a gross process and shame on the team. Yes I know "other teams do this" but that doesn't mean the Cardinals can't be better. It's pennies to them. And he's very good and underpaid anyways.
Interesting the team cited "availability".

Sure seemed there were times last year where Helsley said he wasn't good to pitch.

Lots of flags here. I would stay away from offering him a multi-year deal.

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Fan_In_NY
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Re: 2023 Payroll Thread

Post by Fan_In_NY »

haltz wrote:
March 9 23, 2:49 pm
heyzeus wrote:
March 9 23, 1:26 pm
I was bangin' that Rodon drum, now he's out with one of those very concerning forearm strains. We still should have signed a starter.
I feel the same way, it just doesn't seem like something the risk averse ROI focused Cardinals will do - it's the riskiest contract you can sign and now Rodon and Quintana start the season on the IL. Then again they've spent over a hundred million on LH relievers and Steven Matz (who I still like) in recent memory with absolutely nothing to show for it.
Based on exactly what you said, I would expect the Cards to take whatever surplus they end up with in the MLB OF and trade one of those players to the Marlins for someone like Trevor Rogers or Jesus Luzardo or Edward Cabrera. Cards aren't going to fill 3-4 holes in the Starting Rotation from free agency...maybe 1 max. I assume they will re-sign one of their free agents, pencil in some rookie/prospect who isn't in the rotation this year, so that leaves at least 1 more spot in the rotation - it will be an Arbitration Eligible starting pitcher and will cost them a bat.

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