Mozeliak: "Some Changes" Coming For Cardinals, But Not A Rebuild

[pioneer98]

The only reason to trade Arenado is to do a full rebuild and get high level prospects in return. Not interested in Muncy or whoever

And if you trade Arenado you do the same thing with Goldschmidt

How I feel about trading these guys and going full rebuild is gonna depend on what they get in return

Who am I kidding they won't trade these guys. They're gonna bring them all back and make 1 signing in the off-season like always

[Lesson]

How did they do this?

I think "cheap extensions", over "trade them, and hope they resign" is how I interpret this. Because in the event that they resign, it will be after other teams have driven the price a few million dollars north of what we potentially could've gotten them for on a team friendly extension.

++

The only upside to talking extensions and holding until last minute is the hope the deadline pressure gets them to accept a deal for slightly below market etc.

Otherwise, there is nothing stopping them from making actual moves now and then just re-signing whomever they want to a market deal in the winter anyway (including the players they trade).

According to Denton there was some traction on this front with Flaherty as opposed to Monty who has been dead set on testing the market since the regular season began and will get top value and nothing else.

But why? Flaherty can be traded now and re-signed in the winter for the same deal (unless you're going back to my original comment about trying to save a little money).

In a hypothetical world I told you the difference between extending Flaherty before the TDL vs trading him and signing him in the off-season was $5-10 million a year for 4 years, with that difference being re-invested into the team for a #4-5 SP in the off-season, would you do that or still want to pay Flaherty more to acquire prospects?

[MrCrowesGarden]

My takeaway wasn’t Muncy or Taylor for Arenado, but Muncy and/or Taylor + prospects for Arenado. I still don’t think it’s going to happen.

[AdmiralKird]

Mo's already said not a rebuild, so they're not looking to deal Arenado.

Who am I kidding they won't trade these guys. They're gonna bring them all back and make 1 signing in the off-season like always

Pretty much, come August 1st we'll hear how the deals "just weren't there." Maybe there's an under-the-radar prospect they're high on that they might trade DeJong for or something, but I'm skeptical Mo knows what selling means.

[cardsfantx]

My takeaway wasn’t Muncy or Taylor for Arenado, but Muncy and/or Taylor + prospects for Arenado. I still don’t think it’s going to happen.

Yeah, that’s what I figured as well, but why

I don’t want their trash

If you’re getting arguably the best 3b in baseball who’s signed for a very reasonable rate, then it’s going to cost you multiple top prospects AND mlb ready talent; and we’re not eating any money and not taking back any bad contracts

If they’re not agreeable, I don’t trade him

[Magneto2.0]

I've learned to follow Goold. He leaves little nuggets for a while kinda hinting at what the Cardinals are looking to do, even if he doesn't break the story when it officially happens.

He's been hinting at Clayton Beeter or Randy Vazquez from the Yankees and Logan Gilbert and Bryan Woo from the Mariners as their targets for a minute. Not saying all or any of them will get done, but I trust his insight more than national news media. And he's been dispelled the Arenado rumors. Now that doesn't stop teams from inquiring or potentially knocking them over with a Godfather type offer, but it's not what they're looking to do.

[haltz]

But why? Flaherty can be traded now and re-signed in the winter for the same deal (unless you're going back to my original comment about trying to save a little money).

Yeah, that's why. It won't be the same deal that he'll get on the open market and they'll have 1/3 slots filled going into the offseason.

I don't love the idea or even like Flaherty but if he gives them a deal at the last minute because he's emotional about leaving the nest or whatever I guess you explore it.

[Lesson]

This is who the Cardinals have under contract or who they have arbitration rights that could possibly be a starter next season:

Mikolas
Matz
Hudson
Woodford
Liberatore
Thompson
McGreevy
Graceffo

Assuming they trade Flaherty and Montgomery and don't bring them back in the offseason, the rotation still needs 2-3 starters who are major league ready in 2024. I don't think they can get more than 1 starter combined for 2024 between PDJ, TON, Hicks, DC, and Stratton.

[cardsfantx]

This is who the Cardinals have under contract or who they have arbitration rights that could possibly be a starter next season:

Mikolas
Matz
Hudson
Woodford
Liberatore
Thompson
McGreevy
Graceffo

Assuming they trade Flaherty and Montgomery and don't bring them back in the offseason, the rotation still needs 2-3 starters who are major league ready in 2024. I don't think they can get more than 1 starter combined for 2024 between PDJ, TON, Hicks, DC, and Stratton.

Snell and Nola are both FA and can be had for just money

Won’t happen…but should

[Lesson]

Snell and Nola are both FA and can be had for just money

Won’t happen…but should

Would rather just keep Montgomery over signing Nola.

Aside from Ohtani and Snell, there's not really any potential FA starter that is screaming to me that the Cardinals are much better than what they have with Montgomery.

I'd prioritize signing Montgomery and Flaherty. If one or both say no, then focus on signing two guys like Urias, Rodriguez, Gray, and Giolito and bring in some one cheaper to eat innings and as depth like Gibson.