Scott Rolen for Troy Glaus (Update: Finalized!)

[MrCrowesGarden]

http://www.thestar.com/article/293647

Article from the Toronto Star this morning. It says that the Cards are on the hook for a 4MM bonus to Rolen in 2010, but the Jays are sending 1.8MM in the deal with Glaus.

[jim]

Discuss a trade, I'm all for it. But the declarations in absolutes, belittling contrary opinions and resisting considering the other side isn't discussion, IMO. Which is what was going on when I made that remark prompting T11's hyperbole.

I was just surprised at the remarks, that's all. Please, carry on. Don't mind me.

I've missed some posts, I didn't realize what prompted your comment. Agreed 100%, there are no absolutes and listening is half of debating. And belittling isn't tolerated, even though everyone has probably been guilty to some degree or another.

[Radbird]

Boy, take a weekend off and look what happens.

It'll take a while to plow through all 40 pages. My initial reaction is that if both pass their physicals and the trade is consumated, this is way more than I expected to get for Scotty. I think we might even come out ahead on this - possibly Mo's first plus trade, IMHO. The offense we could gain may more than offset the defensive setback.

And I love Scotty and wish him well, but something had to be done.

[ghostrunner]

From the Toronto Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ ... ory/Sports

Like everyone else, the Blue Jays also know that Rolen has feuded with Cardinals manager Tony LaRussa for the past two years.

Tough to read anything into that. LaRussa has an ego to match or exceed even the best-paid superstar, but Larry Walker said in his short tenure with the team, most veteran Cardinals simply rolled their eyes at his quirks and moved past them, because LaRussa was a winner and made sound fundamental baseball decisions.

Unstated was the fact that he was also successful at bullying both ownership and some elements of the local media. The Cardinals - lavished with uncritical affection from their happy, middle-class, corn-fed, Midwestern fan base and graced to be playing in a one-newspaper town with a deep tradition of baseball excellence - had a cynical group of veterans personified by their distrustful superstar, Albert Pujols. It's possible that Rolen chafed under all that, just as he chafed under manager Larry Bowa in Philadelphia. That in itself is no big deal, because he's joining a list that includes everybody who ever played for Bowa.

I expect this from Philly writers, but Canada?

[MrCrowesGarden]

From the Toronto Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ ... ory/Sports

Like everyone else, the Blue Jays also know that Rolen has feuded with Cardinals manager Tony LaRussa for the past two years.

Tough to read anything into that. LaRussa has an ego to match or exceed even the best-paid superstar, but Larry Walker said in his short tenure with the team, most veteran Cardinals simply rolled their eyes at his quirks and moved past them, because LaRussa was a winner and made sound fundamental baseball decisions.

Unstated was the fact that he was also successful at bullying both ownership and some elements of the local media. The Cardinals - lavished with uncritical affection from their happy, middle-class, corn-fed, Midwestern fan base and graced to be playing in a one-newspaper town with a deep tradition of baseball excellence - had a cynical group of veterans personified by their distrustful superstar, Albert Pujols. It's possible that Rolen chafed under all that, just as he chafed under manager Larry Bowa in Philadelphia. That in itself is no big deal, because he's joining a list that includes everybody who ever played for Bowa.

I expect this from Philly writers, but Canada?

They must be sour because the Leafs are bad a-gain this year.

[sighyoung]

Discuss a trade, I'm all for it. But the declarations in absolutes, belittling contrary opinions and resisting considering the other side isn't discussion, IMO. Which is what was going on when I made that remark prompting T11's hyperbole.

I was just surprised at the remarks, that's all. Please, carry on. Don't mind me.

I've missed some posts, I didn't realize what prompted your comment. Agreed 100%, there are no absolutes and listening is half of debating. And belittling isn't tolerated, even though everyone has probably been guilty to some degree or another.

For what it's worth, KyCardinalFan, I thought your post was fine and clear. tenniseleven either wasn't responding to you, or (in my opinion) misread you.

[Hungary Jack]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ ... ory/Sports

Like everyone else, the Blue Jays also know that Rolen has feuded with Cardinals manager Tony LaRussa for the past two years.

Tough to read anything into that. LaRussa has an ego to match or exceed even the best-paid superstar, but Larry Walker said in his short tenure with the team, most veteran Cardinals simply rolled their eyes at his quirks and moved past them, because LaRussa was a winner and made sound fundamental baseball decisions.

Unstated was the fact that he was also successful at bullying both ownership and some elements of the local media. The Cardinals - lavished with uncritical affection from their happy, middle-class, corn-fed, Midwestern fan base and graced to be playing in a one-newspaper town with a deep tradition of baseball excellence - had a cynical group of veterans personified by their distrustful superstar, Albert Pujols. It's possible that Rolen chafed under all that, just as he chafed under manager Larry Bowa in Philadelphia. That in itself is no big deal, because he's joining a list that includes everybody who ever played for Bowa.

This gave me a good chuckle. I'll happily admit that Canada is a much more civilized country than the US, but I didn't realize that the Canadians had eliminated corn from their diet. Of course, with global warming, they'll soon be growing lots of corn in northern Ontario, so perhaps in time Toronto will have a much more docile fan base...

[maddash]

Discuss a trade, I'm all for it. But the declarations in absolutes, belittling contrary opinions and resisting considering the other side isn't discussion, IMO. Which is what was going on when I made that remark prompting T11's hyperbole.

I was just surprised at the remarks, that's all. Please, carry on. Don't mind me.

I've missed some posts, I didn't realize what prompted your comment. Agreed 100%, there are no absolutes and listening is half of debating. And belittling isn't tolerated, even though everyone has probably been guilty to some degree or another.

For what it's worth, KyCardinalFan, I thought your post was fine and clear. tenniseleven either wasn't responding to you, or (in my opinion) misread you.

I think Ten11 was responding directly to this:

I'm pretty sure this is the forum where I've seen it argued that trades should be evaluated immediately, based primarily on perception, rather than wait to see how they pan out. In other words, if a trade is perceived one way and it turns out another, that's simply luck and the GMs should not be held accountable. You gotta hand it to some people in their creative arguing.

And to be honest, I didn't understand Richie's point either. Whether or not the trade is successful is obviously something that will happen years later... but an evaluation of whether it's a "good" trade or not should happen now.

[robbotis]

Per A Toronto reportet of KFNS, Glaus passed his physical. The Cards are geting $1.8 million in cash as well.

[Michael]

I'm happy with this deal. Going forward I think Glaus is a better bet to produce than Rolen. Other than UZR most respected defense metrics like his defense. I about 3 mos ago I didn't think we could get much for Rolen unless it was a complete payroll dump.