Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

[BW23]

I'm not forfeiting my right to rationally scrutinize Obama should he become president - especially if the dems control all of congress too. I hope you and BW do the same. my personal belief is our country is best served when the two parties check and balance each other. (actually I wish we had more than two parties. ) Lincoln was famous for accepting opposing viewpoints in his cabinet. Its something our country has sorely lacked for a long time.

As much as I despise everything that Obama represents, the lack of checks and balances might scare me more than anything right now. But I guess that's because Obama will get to do anything he wants.

[clement]

clement...take it up with ICE. He said that McCain/Palin are "targeting" these crazies. I've read plenty of ridiculous things on this thread. At least one per page. Maybe closer to 8 per page. But that's at the top. Easily.

My response was one that was ridiculous intentionally to show just how bad ICE's was. Well, I did believe a lot of what I said.

Yes, Obama brings about hope for some reason. I don't get it.

And I don't have a problem with what the campaign itself is saying about Obama. I just think they should have done it much earlier and with more on Wright. I think it says a lot about Obama's judgment, or lack thereof, when you see who he pals around with (at least until he's told not to do so). I think Wright says a lot more about Obama than Ayers. A lot.

But so do a lot of his statements that he truly believes in that he has to take back when he's told not to be so liberal. Like with abortion. Or Iran.

I'm just amazed at how people buy whatever Obama spoon feeds them. The tax thing is a perfect example. It doesn't add up. And when it hurts the economy, I'll bite my tongue so as not to say, "I told you so."

So are you concerned about McCain palling around with Charles Keating? I mean he only disavowed that relationship after he got caught and censured by the Senate. And what about Palin palling around with secessionist organizations? Or her own "crazy" pastors? I mean alll of this stuff can go on forever. So I agree with ICE that McCain and especially Palin are indeed "targeting" these crazies by purposefully trying to whoop up the anger of their base.

I've never been more worried about the direction our country is headed in than I am now.

Me too. That's why we desperately need a change.

[indyredbird]

Just curious, but I would like to know what Obama has done in his background that make you believe he will bring about wonderful change? I am not saying that McCain is the wonderful answer either, I just want to know what you think he has done that has been successful.

Obama brings hope to the table. He' smart and educated. Diverse well-traveled man. Well-respected state senator, US senator. Constitutional lawyer. I see his conduct during this campaign and YES his ability to speak as a positive sign. We currently have a president that can't speak and relate to anyone other than a few cronies. Did you know GWB has made several statements about the financial crisis - but nobody listens to him at home nor abroad. We are like a country without a leader. We sorely need a leader. I could say more but I'm outta here.

anybody with a long history in politics couldn't be elected in this Rove era of politics anyway.. Gore and Kerry had much more qualifications, but it became their downfall. that's the way the GOP made this political game, so why should they complain?

Ok he is bright and articulate, and George Bush sucks, but what has he done?

on Hawaii state champion team in basketball. he's not a Cub fan and that's doing something. x he inhaled back in college. other than that he hasn't done anything.

oh - he was right about the war in Iraq.

in all seriousness, I wouldn't have minded Obama beefing up his creds for a few more years. but again-with way politics are since Rove, Obama had to make his move now, or they'd have four more years of smears to conjure up on him.

in this same vein, your guy Bush didn't have much experience and he's been prez....yikes- maybe I need to rethink this

Why do you say my guy Bush? Well at least you tried to answer my question. I am with BW, I don't see all the appeal with Obama.

[docellis]

i think the biggest appeal regarding Obama is that he isn't republican and is in no way aligned with Bush.

[clement]

I'll say it. I'm not that crazy about Obama. I would have preferred Hillary Clinton.

But I generally support his viewpoints and positions on issues and policies. And certainly far moreso than the Republican alternative. I also think he is a smart and pragmatic guy and I think he will do a fine job as president. I have faith that he will surround himself with the right kind of advisors and that he will be good at listening to, assessing, and integrating differing points of views. I think he will also be good at working with people who disagree with him, rather than just ignoring or marginalizing them. A lot of this is based on the impressions he has left in me during these two years of campaigning. Sure you can question whether he'll do all of these things, just like Bush talked about instituting compassionate conservatism, working with foreign countries, not dictating the US way to the rest of the world, and then he didn't do any of those things. But I have to have faith that he will because if not, my only other alternative is John McCain who has moved so far to the right on so many issues and abandoned so many of his former "maverick" principles that I find I have almost no policy agreements with him other than wanting to reduce pork spending (which is a good idea, but not enough to shift a vote on, much less balance a budget).

[indyredbird]

i think the biggest appeal regarding Obama is that he isn't republican and is in no way aligned with Bush.

And I think Hillary is still wondering what the appeal is too. She's not a Republican and aligned with Bush.

[sighyoung]

i think the biggest appeal regarding Obama is that he isn't republican and is in no way aligned with Bush.

And I think Hillary is still wondering what the appeal is too. She's not a Republican and aligned with Bush.

I think Hillary is still doing the autopsy of her primary run. Obama's political organization, money raising, and strategy were outstanding, and she made crucial mistakes--including assuming that she didn't need to worry about caucuses, and that she'd have everything wrapped up by Super Tuesday.

[clement]

i think the biggest appeal regarding Obama is that he isn't republican and is in no way aligned with Bush.

And I think Hillary is still wondering what the appeal is too. She's not a Republican and aligned with Bush.

I think Hillary is still doing the autopsy of her primary run. Obama's political organization, money raising, and strategy were outstanding, and she made crucial mistakes--including assuming that she didn't need to worry about caucuses, and that she'd have everything wrapped up by Super Tuesday.

Yeah it's just one of those things. Hilary made a few mistakes for sure. But Obama just really caught fire and captured the imagination of and inspired a lot of people. It happens. Usually people like this don't end up being as successful as Obama was (thinking of people like Gary Hart, John Anderson), but he built just a big enough lead on it to take him to the nomination. It also helped him (not her) that a lot of the early primary states favored him (disproportionately southern states), and the whole problem with Michigan and Florida delegates didn't help her. Plus what sigh said about the caucuses (I think Obama won all but one of the caucus states).

[cpebbles]

First of all, I think my post that you quoted showed that I wasn't being serious.

But why do you think there is hatred of Muslims? When did it start? For those who have this hatred, I'd guess it started just over 7 years ago.

Yeah, you joked about the depth of American hatred for Muslims, to offset your first point, that it's justified to hate Muslims because a handful of them have attacked U.S. soil. And your second statement just proves that further.

[ghostrunner]

A couple of things I've heard from Obama that impress me:

First, the speech on race. I've never heard as good a political speech in my life. And it wasn't just simply "a good speech," it demonstrated a willingness to address a tough issue and look at it in an even-handed way. The fact that he wrote it himself is even more impressive. Not only that, but let's look at what brought it about. The whole Jeremiah Wright issue came up, and Obama was initially misleading and tried to quickly dismiss it. Bill Clinton would have continued down that road, believing he didn't have to answer it. And he'd probably be right. It couldn't be proved that Obama was there when the controversial sermons were given, and we know that not all of Wright's sermons were like that.

But instead it appears to me that Obama and his people said "Okay, what's the issue here? What do you want to know? If I agree with him or not?" So he came up with a thoughtful, comprehensive speech detailing his feelings on the matter, and his own experiences that relate to it. Instead of evading or minimizing, ala Clinton, he addressed the core issue and pretty much defused it. I found it refreshing.

Second, I mentioned it the other day but I heard him say something a few weeks ago and I forget what it was in relation to, but he said "I don't want to let what's best get in the way of what's good." I found that reassuring in the sense that it suggest that believes in reaching compromise, and far from someone who's going to steer the country down some socialist path. His past also suggests that he's level headed and willing to work with people of both parties to get things done.


As far as what he's done, this is a list of bills he's put forward in the Senate:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_bi ... tes_Senate

Then also these two:

This figure does not include bills to which Obama contributed very substantially as cosponsor, such as the Coburn-Obama Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act of 2006 or the Lugar-Nunn Cooperative Proliferation Detection, Interdiction Assistance, and Conventional Threat Reduction Act of 2006.

I don't know how much more he can be expected to have done, as he's a Senator and this is what they do.