Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

[KyCardinalFan]

Last night at dinner I met someone who worked for John McCain for about 3 years in the early part of this decade. I was really intrigued to hear more about him so I asked a lot of questions. Some of the main points he made:

- John McCain is a great guy; really nice and friendly to everyone and has a genuinely good sense of humor
- He's shocked at how lucid and healthy he appears on the campaign trail because when he was working with him he looked very old and unhealthy with lots of shakes; he said the amount of makeup he is wearing must be enormous and he even wondered if he's being sedated to control some of the physical manifestations of his ailments/age
- He can't believe how much energy he has to do all this campaigning given his age and health
- He confirmed his reputation as being erratic and quick to fly off the handle; he said he would often just come out of nowhere with an idea or change his mind on something completely that would take everyone else by surprise

I read this not long before I saw the repeat of Meet the Press. First I went to YouTube to watch videos from January and February to see if he has aged over the year as Christopher Hitchens has stated. Maybe a little bit, but not as stark as I would've thought. As I watched MTP, however, I was struck by his holding and handling a pen. As a result of your post, I was watching it so much I sometimes missed what he was saying! He held and fiddled with the pen and I noticed he had no paper in front of him. It had to be there as a prop. I told my husband about it as we watched and he suggested that maybe that was why he was always writing during the debates. (Plus, he wouldn't have to look at Obamam. lol)

This post just really stuck with me and will likely have me looking at him much closer.

[jim]

Except when they've done things like elect Adolf Hitler.

I understand why progressives and libertarians want a third party, but I'm rather happy with a system that favors bland centrists like Obama.

Heck, we've had Dick Cheney for the last eight years.

How's that worked for us?

We've been a whisper from martial law for the last four years.
Torture, no habeus corpus, no posse commitatus, illegal war,
and spying on American citizens. Maybe not Hitler material,
but certainly not the America I thought I knew.

Um, maybe not Hitler material? Every day for a year I walked past a memorial for a synagogue burned down on Kristallnacht, so the difference is stark to me.

I understood exactly what pop meant by "Maybe not Hitler material", and it wasn't maybe not Hitler material.

[jim]

I don't believe that the far right can be anything more than a supplement to a party. Most people I know, even religious people, are really turned off by the far right. No way a party can be centered around that and succeed. If I'm misjudging that, then I don't know or understand this country any longer. I do not consider Reagan and Bush I Republicans to be anywhere close to what the conservatives in the party are today. That may be where it started, but where that party was and where the neo-cons of today want the party to be are different places.

I agree with richie mostly, but I do think McCain's best chance was to be himself.

What I stated the other day in why I lean right is pretty much far right, IMO. Obviously, religion plays a part with how I view certain issues (abortion, for example). And I know very, very, very, very few Christians who aren't conservatives. So I don't know what religious people you've talked to (or what religion they are, but it's quite the contrast from those I talk to.

But I guess we contrast on, well, everything.

I have no doubt that in your world that is how it is.

[Popeye_Card]

And I know very, very, very, very few Christians who aren't conservatives. So I don't know what religious people you've talked to (or what religion they are, but it's quite the contrast from those I talk to.

I grew up in a town not far from where you live where 80%+ of the Christians vote Democrat. They're staunchly pro-life, but Democrats in Illinois have been a lot friendlier to farming over the years, so they vote with what feeds them.

Another example, the Boston area is very Catholic, yet very liberal. A futher example, the black community (~14% of total US population) is by-and-large Christian, yet you would rarely classify one as conservative. Same goes for hispanics.

You're right that the evangelical Bible Belt is very conservative. But you have to keep in mind that that doesn't encompass all, or even most Christians.

[Radbird]

True, Popeye. I've mentioned this before, but my Grandma (who went to Mass every day) kept 2 pictures in her kitchen. The pope and Pres. Kennedy.

[BW23]

I don't believe that the far right can be anything more than a supplement to a party. Most people I know, even religious people, are really turned off by the far right. No way a party can be centered around that and succeed. If I'm misjudging that, then I don't know or understand this country any longer. I do not consider Reagan and Bush I Republicans to be anywhere close to what the conservatives in the party are today. That may be where it started, but where that party was and where the neo-cons of today want the party to be are different places.

I agree with richie mostly, but I do think McCain's best chance was to be himself.

What I stated the other day in why I lean right is pretty much far right, IMO. Obviously, religion plays a part with how I view certain issues (abortion, for example). And I know very, very, very, very few Christians who aren't conservatives. So I don't know what religious people you've talked to (or what religion they are, but it's quite the contrast from those I talk to.

But I guess we contrast on, well, everything.

I have no doubt that in your world that is how it is.

What's that mean?

[jim]

I don't believe that the far right can be anything more than a supplement to a party. Most people I know, even religious people, are really turned off by the far right. No way a party can be centered around that and succeed. If I'm misjudging that, then I don't know or understand this country any longer. I do not consider Reagan and Bush I Republicans to be anywhere close to what the conservatives in the party are today. That may be where it started, but where that party was and where the neo-cons of today want the party to be are different places.

I agree with richie mostly, but I do think McCain's best chance was to be himself.

What I stated the other day in why I lean right is pretty much far right, IMO. Obviously, religion plays a part with how I view certain issues (abortion, for example). And I know very, very, very, very few Christians who aren't conservatives. So I don't know what religious people you've talked to (or what religion they are, but it's quite the contrast from those I talk to.

But I guess we contrast on, well, everything.

I have no doubt that in your world that is how it is.

What's that mean?

It means that I believe you, but that it's not how it is elsewhere.

[BW23]

okay

[cards2468]

A few years ago didn't France have this situation with multiple parties, and the vote was spread between them, and some Nazi dude made it to the final runoff?

Yes. Jean-Marie Le Pen. He wasn't an actual nazi, but he was definitely a xenophobic, ultra-nationalist fascist who was both anti-Semitic and anti-Muslim. Basically he's anti-foreigner. But yeah, he shocked the world when he came in second in the 2002 presidential election beating out the socialist candidate Lionel Jospin. So the runoff was between Chirac and Le Pen. I took part in a march in Paris in favor of Chirac. This was a case where all the people on the left came out in full force to back the candidate on the right, to send a strong message that Le Pen's politics were not welcome. Chirac won the runoff with 82% of the vote.

I believe Germany has a political party very similar to this. Many people in Germany have problems with Turkish immigrants similar to the way many people here have problems with Mexican immigrants, however the political party in Germany is quite strong and incredibly racist

[JCShutout]

And I know very, very, very, very few Christians who aren't conservatives.

Hi, my name is JCShutout. Nice to meet you.